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Phil- La Costa
Intermediate Member
Username: Prg
Post Number: 32
Registered: 01-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, June 24, 2009 - 10:30 pm: | 
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I am no longer getting TV Guide on my Samsung DLP. I thought it was previously on KPBS analog which is now gone. I still have 6 analog active in the tuner as I remember reading that it was moved there. For the last several days nothing. Anyone have any ideas? phil |
Michael Scott
Advanced Member
Username: Mikeyts
Post Number: 2876
Registered: 08-2003
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, June 24, 2009 - 10:46 pm: |
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I thought that it was taken over by XETV, since they're still running their analog channel with no immediate intention to stop (and no regulation forcing them, being owned by a Mexican company and transmitted out of Mexico).
My Mitsubishi television has an up to date guide, but it's connected via cable. Still, I think that it would have to find the guide data encoded in the VBI of one of the analog signals.
"Think of the cable company as a group of terrorist (sic)." -- hookbill
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Jay
Advanced Member
Username: Jay214128
Post Number: 228
Registered: 06-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, June 25, 2009 - 08:16 am: |
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I can confirm that XETV-TV (channel 6, NTSC, analog) IS carrying the TVGOS data OTA. I do not know what the cable companies might be doing with the analog signal. My Sony and Panasonic DVRs are getting their guide data from XETV-TV. Some newer devices (TVs, DVRs) support digital TVGOS, which XETV-DT and KCBS-DT are broadcasting. |
Gary Stigall, XETV
Moderator
Username: Garys
Post Number: 504
Registered: 12-2002
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, June 25, 2009 - 08:52 am: |
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I confirmed a few days ago that we are broadcasting the TVGOS data on both DTV and analog. And I confirmed that Time Warner Cable is carrying TVGOS on DTV channel 706 (6-1 on some sets).
However, some cable companies, like Time Warner in San Diego, are now supplying at least some analog channels from a downconversion of local DTV signals. We know they are doing this for XETV. This likely strips the TVGOS signal off for channel 6.
Phil, you might rescan on your Samsung DLP. Whether you can get that data alternately from KPBS, I'm not sure. Your set may be old enough that it can't decode DTV TVGOS.
Gary Stigall
Dir. of Engineering
Bay City TV - XETV
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Phil- La Costa
Intermediate Member
Username: Prg
Post Number: 33
Registered: 01-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, June 25, 2009 - 10:33 am: |
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Thanks for the replies. Gary, I am up in La Costa, ota with 4228 pointed directly at XETV. That heading is down the middle between Soledad and Miguel from here. Analog is pretty weak, 6-1 is usually solid 98% of the time, but has been weaker last week or so. I suppose the analog signal may be too weak to decode the TV Guide data but I always get a raster, fairly snowy, and audio. 15-0 is gone, 15-1 is solid but my TV does not seem to decode guide data there. After getting used to the TV Guide for several years, we miss it. phil |
Gary Stigall, XETV
Moderator
Username: Garys
Post Number: 505
Registered: 12-2002
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, June 25, 2009 - 10:53 am: |
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I wouldn't give up on the TVGOS even with a snowy analog picture. Vertical blanking interval (VBI) data is quite robust because it's relatively slow digital information.
If you find that doesn't work, you may need to improve your antenna a bit. A 4228 has no gain on low-band VHF. You would do better with an FM antenna, either commercial, or just one of those Radio Shack 42-2385 folded wire dipoles tacked under the eaves of your house, facing south. If you mount it about 6" from your stucco wall, you get some gain from the metal mesh in the stucco. Cut off the bottom part of the "T" and attach a 15-1253 300-ohm-to-75-ohm transformer to make the coax run into your house. You could even use an FM/TV combiner so that you run only one coax inside.
Gary Stigall
Dir. of Engineering
Bay City TV - XETV
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Michael Scott
Advanced Member
Username: Mikeyts
Post Number: 2877
Registered: 08-2003
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, June 25, 2009 - 11:31 am: |
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So, Gary, you don't think TVGOS is present on any analog channel on TWC? That would mean my 3 y/o Mits panel can read it from digital channe3ls. Cool  (though I rarely use the TV's tuner).
"Think of the cable company as a group of terrorist (sic)." -- hookbill
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holl_ands
Advanced Member
Username: Holl_ands
Post Number: 2155
Registered: 06-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, June 25, 2009 - 01:30 pm: |
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On TWC-SD, maybe it's Analog CH90 vice Digital Simulcast reincarnated CH6?
I've never figured out why they need two analog Ch6's..... |
Gary Stigall, XETV
Moderator
Username: Garys
Post Number: 506
Registered: 12-2002
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, June 26, 2009 - 09:15 am: |
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I confirmed that TVGOS data exists on the VBI of analog channels XETV-6 and KPBS-11 on Time Warner Cable in Kearny Mesa. I couldn't confirm that it's valid, but levels looked good.
I also confirmed that TVGOS data does NOT exist on our closed circuit feed to Cox Cable due to the encoder equipment we use that blanks these lines. Not the fault of Cox Cable.
As previously mentioned, I confirmed earlier in the week that we have valid TVGOS information on our digital (706 or 6-1) services, at least on Time Warner Cable.
It's on both OTA feeds on channels 6 analog and 23 digital as well.
You should be good to go.
Gary Stigall
Dir. of Engineering
Bay City TV - XETV
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Phil- La Costa
Intermediate Member
Username: Prg
Post Number: 34
Registered: 01-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, June 28, 2009 - 11:04 pm: |
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Well I made no changes and TV Guide data was again populated today. Who knows? |
Bob Schuchman
New member
Username: Bobsch
Post Number: 1
Registered: 12-2009
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, December 01, 2009 - 03:08 pm: |
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I finally got to this forum today while trying to find out why I lost TVGOS to my Sony rdr-hx715 DVD recoder.
Gary said in June there was no TVGOS to Cox, but I've had TVGOS from the Cox RF for years until November.
I gather that the Sony needs an analog signal. Does this mean that I'll never get TVGOS again? |
Jay
Advanced Member
Username: Jay214128
Post Number: 254
Registered: 06-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, December 01, 2009 - 04:26 pm: |
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It is available on XETV channel 6 OTA. I'm currently using XETV channel 6 OTA to get guide data on my Sony DHG-HDD250/500s and Panasonic EH55. You can also use a converter box to convert the digital version of TVGOS (available on XETV-DT and KCBS-DT) to the analog form. Check the avs forums for the converter boxes that support this (Artec and Dish TR-40 (DTV PAL) I think). |
Gary Stigall, XETV
Moderator
Username: Garys
Post Number: 545
Registered: 12-2002
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, December 01, 2009 - 09:38 pm: |
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KPBS quit broadcasting TVGOS November 1. XETV still has it on both analog and digital channels over-the-air, but we strip it from the analog channel 6 feed to the cable companies due to the design of the transmission equipment. I wish it were otherwise.
Some customers use an over-the-air antenna to gather the data from XETV-6 analog overnight, then switch back to cable during the day.
As Jay says, not every DTV converter box passes TVGOS from XETV-DT 23.
(Message edited by garys on December 02, 2009)
Gary Stigall
Dir. of Engineering
Bay City TV - XETV
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Phil- La Costa
Intermediate Member
Username: Prg
Post Number: 41
Registered: 01-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, December 01, 2009 - 09:46 pm: |
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A while ago i again noticed that the guide info was gone on my Samsung DLP. I still receive 6-0, not great signal strength but somewhat watchable. Possibly too weak for the guide data to pass. |
Michael Scott
Advanced Member
Username: Mikeyts
Post Number: 2970
Registered: 08-2003
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, December 02, 2009 - 11:28 am: |
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Gary Stigall, XETV: "KPBS quit broadcasting TVGOS November 1. XETV still has it on both analog and digital channels over-the-air, but we strip it when transmitting to the cable companies due to the design of the transmission equipment. I wish it were otherwise." So basically cable customers who can't catch either of your signals OTA are SOL? Sounds like Rovi (known as Macrovision when they assimilated Gemstar/TV Guide) needs to start making deals for data carriage with cable providers.
I could be wrong, but I'm assuming that TVGOS data is provided in your digital broadcast as a data subchannel? If so, the cable providers could put it in the transport stream of any QAM carrier. My Diamond-series Mits panel has TVGOS and I recently had Mitsubishi send me a thumb drive with a firmware upgrade to handle TVGOS on digital channels, but I rarely view its tuner; after my move three or four months back, I don't think that I bothered to hook a split of the cable to it. Still, I feel for local people who have this feature and depend on it.
"Think of the cable company as a group of terrorist (sic)." -- hookbill
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Gary Stigall, XETV
Moderator
Username: Garys
Post Number: 546
Registered: 12-2002
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, December 02, 2009 - 12:19 pm: |
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TVGOS is carried on all XETV digital distribution streams, so having a QAM carrier to send TVGOS VBI would be redundant.
Only those cable customers who depend on analog only are SOL with respect to channel 6.
By the way, stations receive no compensation for this.
Gary Stigall
Dir. of Engineering
Bay City TV - XETV
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Michael Scott
Advanced Member
Username: Mikeyts
Post Number: 2971
Registered: 08-2003
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, December 02, 2009 - 12:46 pm: |
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Okay--I was misinterpreting "...on both analog and digital channels over-the-air, but we strip it when transmitting to the cable companies...", to mean that it gets stripped from both the analog and digital channels.
I'm surprised that you carry it gratis. I always thought that it was revenue generating for PBS affiliates. Really nice of the stations who carry it, since there's no way that you can receive any kind of credit with local viewers for that largess.
EDIT: It looks as though PBS is (or was) carrying TVGOS through their for-profit subsidiary National Datacast, Inc., so it probably has been revenue generating for them.
(Message edited by mikeyts on December 02, 2009)
"Think of the cable company as a group of terrorist (sic)." -- hookbill
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Gary Stigall, XETV
Moderator
Username: Garys
Post Number: 547
Registered: 12-2002
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, December 02, 2009 - 01:08 pm: |
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You're right--I misspoke about the feed and have edited it for posterity.
For the time being, we have two separate feeds to Cox Cable and AT&T, but eventually everything will be downconverted from a single feed.
What I am saying is that information on analog vertical blanking interval will soon go the way of the dodo bird, at least for us. But expect this to happen industry wide.
Gary Stigall
Dir. of Engineering
Bay City TV - XETV
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Bob Schuchman
New member
Username: Bobsch
Post Number: 2
Registered: 12-2009
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, December 07, 2009 - 04:04 pm: |
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Gary,
I decided to try switching between cable and OTA to get TVGOS. I got an Artec T3AP box and I'm going to try and get TVGOS from XETV OTA as long as you provide it. No matter how long/short that may be.
I do need an antenna that will pick up your signal. I'm at 700 or so feet up in Del Cerro. The FM antenna I found in an old box wouldn't do it.
I should have line of site. Where is the XETV antenna located? |
Jay
Advanced Member
Username: Jay214128
Post Number: 255
Registered: 06-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, December 07, 2009 - 05:01 pm: |
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Bob,
I'm assuming that your Sony rdr-hx715 DVD recoder has an analog NTSC only tuner (not ATSC digital). If that's the case, I'm not sure you need a converter box, since TVGOS is available in San Diego OTA on both analog (XETV ch 6) and digital (XETV-DT). There is no need to use a converter box to convert the digital form to analog form -- just use the available analog format.
The converter boxes are OTA only (no QAM), so will not work to convert the digital TVGOS available on cable to analog. I also remember reading something in the AVS forums that the digital TVGOS data stream is different than the analog one, so may contain different information when converted to analog than the original analog version does. |
Bob Schuchman
New member
Username: Bobsch
Post Number: 3
Registered: 12-2009
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, December 07, 2009 - 06:28 pm: |
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Jay,
I think I understand. All I need is to switch the Sony to an antenna to pick up analog OTA TVGOS at night and back to cable when I want to get cable programming. Right? |
Gary Stigall, XETV
Moderator
Username: Garys
Post Number: 551
Registered: 12-2002
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, December 07, 2009 - 07:01 pm: |
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Jay is correct. Just switch to your FM dipole to pick up analog channel 6 at night; don't use a digital converter box. You will have to fiddle around with the dipole to get the best picture first. It doesn't have to be a strong picture, but nearly snow free. Outdoors or at least in a southerly window should work best.
Our transmitter is on Mt. San Antonio in Tijuana.
Gary Stigall
Dir. of Engineering
Bay City TV - XETV
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Bob Schuchman
New member
Username: Bobsch
Post Number: 4
Registered: 12-2009
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, December 09, 2009 - 02:00 pm: |
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OK. I'll try it tonight. Do you think that once I get the TVGOS signal the Sony will let me designate whose cable I'm using like it used to do. In other words, did it stop doing a TVGOS setup when there was no signal? |
Gary Stigall, XETV
Moderator
Username: Garys
Post Number: 553
Registered: 12-2002
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, December 09, 2009 - 03:57 pm: |
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Our Sony TV lets us pick AUTO or a designated channel, but software changes rapidly. Your mileage may very. If you have two antenna/cable inlets, you may be in business without having to switch anything.
Gary Stigall
Dir. of Engineering
Bay City TV - XETV
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Bob Schuchman
New member
Username: Bobsch
Post Number: 5
Registered: 12-2009
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, December 09, 2009 - 11:12 pm: |
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Forgive my "shorthand." When I said Sony I meant my Sony RCR-HX715 DVD Recorder. When I first got it, there was a selection on the Setup screen that asked for a zipcode and then showed all the possible cable sources for that zipcode. That choice disappeared shortly after the TVGOS signal was turned off. I was confused for a time because loss of the signal for a few days to a week has happened occasionally in the past.
I got a slightly noisy, but stable picture on XETV with a little rabbit-ear antenna I bought at Radio Shack earlier today. I'm going to wait a couple of days to see what develops. |
Bob Schuchman
Junior Member
Username: Bobsch
Post Number: 6
Registered: 12-2009
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, December 12, 2009 - 07:03 pm: |
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I've kept the recorder off for 3 days now and I still can't get the cable choice menu. I have no way of knowing if I'm picking up TVGOS if I can't use it with the recorders setup.
Time for another talk with Sony. |
SC_92029
Advanced Member
Username: Sc88
Post Number: 281
Registered: 07-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, December 21, 2009 - 06:57 pm: |
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my Sony HDD500 DVR has been a door stop for some time since the analog switch over. I then tried the fw upgrade to hope for the digital TVGOS to work. but no luck. now I know why: with my OTA antenna, I don't get XETV digital at all, and only faintly XETV analog. ah Gary, though XETV doesn't get compensation for carrying TVGOS, it certainly would convince me to try to get XETV reception again. I doubt that my reception from Escondido (behind a hill) has improved...
so I thought CBS has a contract to carry TVGOS digitally. is that coming for San Diego market? is XETV the only station carrying TVGOS as per the list below?
http://www.rabbitears.info/market.php?request=tvgos |
Jay
Advanced Member
Username: Jay214128
Post Number: 257
Registered: 06-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, December 22, 2009 - 08:14 am: |
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KCBS-DT carries the TVGOS signal. |
Bob Schuchman
Junior Member
Username: Bobsch
Post Number: 7
Registered: 12-2009
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, January 20, 2010 - 03:39 pm: |
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I've been in communication with Rovi and Cox about TVGOS.
Rovi (Jan, 4, 2010): "This is a known issue in the San Diego area. We have recently installed new equipment in the area, and our engineer is working with Cox Cable. We expect TVGOS data to be again passing in your area in the next 2 weeks, possibly sooner."
Cox (Jan 19, 2010): "I understand that you are inquiring about the TV GOS.
It is now available on digital channel 98. It is not available without a digital receiver.
TV Guide staff is working toward a solution for analog transmission but there is no estimated time for restoration at present."
So we wait! |
Mike Mantle
Advanced Member
Username: Mm1
Post Number: 414
Registered: 09-2003
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, January 21, 2010 - 09:22 am: |
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Bob, I plugged my old TVGOS unit back in over night and it came up with all the guide info this morning. Seems to be working on Cox. Rovi must have completed their work. |
Bob Schuchman
Junior Member
Username: Bobsch
Post Number: 8
Registered: 12-2009
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, January 22, 2010 - 01:21 am: |
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Hooray! I've got it too.
Now all I need to do is setup the channels I want and turn off those I don't watch. That will take a long time, but it's worth it.
One of the best features of my Sony RDR-HX715 DVD Recorder is that you can search for programs by name at least 7 or 8 days ahead.
I'm going to send a thank you to Rovi. |
Michael Zaragoza
New member
Username: Ragweed
Post Number: 1
Registered: 05-2010
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, May 11, 2010 - 03:43 pm: |
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Thought I could get access to channel 98 by just requesting a cablecard and paying the $2 per month but from talking to Cox right now they require the customers to also purchase a digital cable package for an additional $7 per month. What a rip-off, especially since a cablecard isn't compatible with the on-demand services that digital cable is suppose to provide! |
Michael Scott
Advanced Member
Username: Mikeyts
Post Number: 3091
Registered: 08-2003
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, May 11, 2010 - 03:56 pm: |
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The sole purpose of CableCARD is to provide access to encrypted channels. If you aren't going to subscribe to any encrypted channels then it's reasonable that they won't let you lease one.
"Think of the cable company as a group of terrorist (sic)." -- hookbill
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Simon Parry
Intermediate Member
Username: Simonp
Post Number: 71
Registered: 06-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, May 11, 2010 - 04:06 pm: |
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MS: You'd think so, wouldn't you?
In my naivety, I requested a CableCard from TW some years ago, because their advertising at the time listed the channels that could be received with one (no mention of having to sign up for the channels!).
The engineer arrived, and I asked him which channels I'd be able to receive, and he listed the ClearQAM channels I was already receiving. Obviously, he left shortly after that, without completing the installation. I contacted TW to complain about their misleading advertising, and the web page concerned was taken offline within an hour. |
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