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Message |
    
Saul
New member
Username: Fishnugget
Post Number: 1
Registered: 03-2010
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, March 21, 2010 - 01:05 pm: | 
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Hi guys,
I am new to this forum and wanted to ask if its even worth buying antennas for my location?
I live in an apartment on the second floor (highest) and probably cant add an antenna to the rooftop. However, I think I can add an antenna to my balcony which oversees the south area. I think indoor may be my best bet?
I own a Pioneer PDP-5071 720p or 1080i. Here is my info, from TVfool,
http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3db7c856c4d8a7eb |
Micawber
Advanced Member
Username: Micawber
Post Number: 224
Registered: 11-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, March 21, 2010 - 03:08 pm: |
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Did you put a height number in when creating the tvfool data? The numbers in the report don't look promising as it is.
99.5% Dark Matter
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Saul
New member
Username: Fishnugget
Post Number: 2
Registered: 03-2010
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, March 21, 2010 - 06:25 pm: |
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No, I did not. I'm on the second floor, what height number should I use or base if off of? |
Saul
New member
Username: Fishnugget
Post Number: 3
Registered: 03-2010
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, March 21, 2010 - 06:31 pm: |
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Ok, here is the report with an antenna height of 20ft. Which is about how high my antenna can be.
http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3db7c8e36678808b |
Micawber
Advanced Member
Username: Micawber
Post Number: 225
Registered: 11-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, March 21, 2010 - 07:42 pm: |
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Those numbers look better. I would try a very simple wire antenna first to see if I could get anything. If you have some "twinlead" (flat TV wire), you could make a "folded dipole" antenna to hang on your balcony. You will also need a 300 ohm to 75 ohm converter to connect to your TV. These are very low cost. Note that three of the SD channels are on high VHF and the rest are UHF. Good luck.
99.5% Dark Matter
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Saul
New member
Username: Fishnugget
Post Number: 4
Registered: 03-2010
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, March 21, 2010 - 08:04 pm: |
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OK, just to let you know, I went out and bought the Terk HDTVa antenna to "test" if I could get anything. These are the channels I got when I pointed the antenna southeast from my balcony.
15.1 KPBS HD
15.2 V-me
39.1 KNSD HD
39.2 NBC+
39.3 US NBC
51.1 KUSI HD
69.1 KSWB-DT HD
46 Univision (weak but viewable)
42 Azteca America (weak but viewable)
Can I do better than this? I cant seem to get ABC or CBS. |
Saul
New member
Username: Fishnugget
Post Number: 5
Registered: 03-2010
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, March 21, 2010 - 08:09 pm: |
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Thanks for the folded dipole diagram. I need to do some research cause I dont even know what "twinlead wire" is. |
Micawber
Advanced Member
Username: Micawber
Post Number: 226
Registered: 11-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 22, 2010 - 06:17 am: |
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I would not bother with the folded dipole then.
You are missing the high vhf channels KFMB, KGTV and XETV. These may require another antenna.
99.5% Dark Matter
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Saul
Junior Member
Username: Fishnugget
Post Number: 6
Registered: 03-2010
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 22, 2010 - 09:43 am: |
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Can you recommend a vhf antenna? This Terk antenna supposedly has vhf. |
holl_ands
Advanced Member
Username: Holl_ands
Post Number: 2305
Registered: 06-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 22, 2010 - 09:52 am: |
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XETV-DT is on Ch23....their Analog station is still on Ch6.
If RabbitEars on back of HDTVa didn't get Ch8&10, you're have
to try a REAL Hi-VHF antenna, such as Antennacraft Y-5-13,
RCA ANT751 (aka EZHD) or Antennas Direct C5. All provide up to 7 dBi Gain.
C5 comes with a VHF/UHF Combiner. Others will require a UVSJ.
Point Hi-VHF antenna towards Mt Soledad (La Jolla) and HDTVa
towards Mt Miguel (Spring Valley).
You are too far away to receive XETV-DT (negative NM).
You MIGHT get Analog Ch6 if you point the antenna due South. |
Saul
Junior Member
Username: Fishnugget
Post Number: 7
Registered: 03-2010
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 22, 2010 - 11:44 am: |
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holl_ands thanks!
I am going to give the hdtva antenna one more try this afternoon, hopefully I can pick up some vhf channels.
I'll check out the antennas you suggested. Hopefully they wont burn a hole in my pocket.  |
Saul
Junior Member
Username: Fishnugget
Post Number: 8
Registered: 03-2010
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 22, 2010 - 05:13 pm: |
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holl_ands,
I am thinking of buying the RCA ANT751. I want to try this antenna out. What else do I need besides the UVSJ? A splitter maybe? Thanks. |
Saul
Junior Member
Username: Fishnugget
Post Number: 9
Registered: 03-2010
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 22, 2010 - 05:34 pm: |
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Also, do they have it anywhere in San Diego where I can buy it in case I have to return it. Thanks. |
Saul
Junior Member
Username: Fishnugget
Post Number: 10
Registered: 03-2010
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 22, 2010 - 07:14 pm: |
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After some research I found out my local walmart carries it, thanks. |
Saul
Member
Username: Fishnugget
Post Number: 11
Registered: 03-2010
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, March 23, 2010 - 12:56 pm: |
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Ok, I mounted the RCA ANT751 to a 10ft mounting pole on my balcony to test the signals and I found it to have slightly better results than the HDTVa. I think it may have been better because it was higher. I still was unable to get CBS and ABC, there must be a big mountain blocking the signal. This has prompted me try the HDTVa antenna mounted to the same pole to compare. I think the HDTVa might perform better. The HDTVa is also alot smaller. |
Jo
Advanced Member
Username: Sandog
Post Number: 232
Registered: 07-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, March 23, 2010 - 02:07 pm: |
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I recommend you use a converter box for tuning purposes. I have a HDTVa antenna, and it doesn't take much movement, a few inches, to loose some stations. The advantage of the converter box over the using the TV is that you can monitor channels with the signal quality meter while you move the antenna around. With the TV scan, the signal has to be strong in order to be mapped, otherwise the tuner usually defaults to monitoring in analog mode. |
Saul
Member
Username: Fishnugget
Post Number: 12
Registered: 03-2010
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, March 23, 2010 - 07:07 pm: |
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Hey Jo,
Are there any converter boxes you recommend? I totally agree with what you saying. The HDTVa antenna is sensitive to changes. |
holl_ands
Advanced Member
Username: Holl_ands
Post Number: 2308
Registered: 06-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, March 24, 2010 - 01:30 pm: |
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Apex DT502 has been "calibrated" against professional Signal Level Meters:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=16166929&postcount=9117
It has slightly higher quality S-Video output, Analog Pass-Thru
and (FWIW) a Smart Antenna I/F:
http://www.apexdigitalinc.com/manual/DT502_manual.pdf
You might want to avoid the Sansonic FT300A. It won't support
adding stations when you change antenna directions and only
displays info for program currently being watched (no guide).
Alternatively, if you already have a compatible USB Tuner or
want to buy one for your laptop anyway, consider using the
(FREE!!!) TSReader Lite to observe the packet error rates
and detected SNR improving as you approach signal lock.
This will allow you to tweak the antenna location and direction
long before there is sufficient signal strength for the CECB:
http://www.tsreader.com/tsreader/index.html
Unfortunately, only certain USB/PCI Tuners work with TSReader:
http://www.tsreader.com/tsreader/hardware.html
ONLY look at the ATSC devices, such as:
AirStar HD-5000 PCI
AirStar HD-5000 USB
AutumnWave OnAir USB HDTV Creator
AutumnWave On-Air GT
AverMedia A180 8VSB card
Hauppauge WinTV HVR-950
Hauppauge WinTV HVR-950Q
Hauppauge WinTV HVR-1600
Hauppauge WinTV-HVR-1250
Hauppauge WinTV-HVR-1500
Hauppauge WinTV-HVR-1500q
Hauppauge WinTV-HVR-1800
Hauppauge WinTV-HVR-1800lp
Hauppauge WinTV-HVR-1950
Hauppauge WinTV-HVR-2250
HDHomeRun Dual tuner 8VSB/QAM via Ethernet I/F
pcHDTV 3000 8VSB card (works with Linux)
(Message edited by holl_ands on March 24, 2010) |
holl_ands
Advanced Member
Username: Holl_ands
Post Number: 2309
Registered: 06-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, March 24, 2010 - 01:58 pm: |
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BTW: With a NM greater than 10 dB for Ch8 & Ch10 and a clear "view"
South towards Mt Soledad from your balcony, you "should" get them,
even though they are diffracted off some hills on the way to you.
Are there some buildings or other obstacles also in the way????
How about an industrial area with welders and other equipment???
Can you try mounting the RCA ANT751 as far away from the building
and other metal as possible???
(Message edited by holl_ands on March 24, 2010) |
Saul
Member
Username: Fishnugget
Post Number: 13
Registered: 03-2010
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, March 24, 2010 - 03:52 pm: |
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Whoa! Lots of info. there. Thanks holl_ands. I just called my cable company and they told me basic was 18 bucks for 22 channels, wife said no way.
I put the RCA ANT751 on a 10 ft pole and my balcony is already about 15ft off the ground so it was about 25 ft high. Of course I did this at night so my landlord wouldn't see me.
However, I gave up because I dont think she is going to allow me to have it. It just stands out too much. I will definately look into those convertor boxes you mentioned.
I do have some big mountains that I believe are blocking me and preventing me from acquiring abc and cbs. Sucks. I'm sure if I was allowed to mount it on the rooftop I may possibly get them but that probably wont happen. |
Simon Parry
Intermediate Member
Username: Simonp
Post Number: 59
Registered: 06-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, March 24, 2010 - 04:42 pm: |
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Saul,
I used to be on the board of our HOA, and we were informed that there are FCC regulations that mean that an HOA (and thence through your landlord) cannot prevent you from putting up an antenna (or satellite dish) provided that you follow their stated guidelines for conformity.
Check out this URL:
http://www.neighborhoodlink.com/article/Association/FCC_Satellite_Antenna_Regula tions |
Saul
Member
Username: Fishnugget
Post Number: 14
Registered: 03-2010
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, March 24, 2010 - 09:47 pm: |
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Thanks Simon,
I'm just going to ask my landlord after skimming that article. Then maybe show her the article and what I am entitled to. I will keep everyone posted. |
DG La Mesa
Junior Member
Username: Dg_la_mesa
Post Number: 10
Registered: 01-2010
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, March 25, 2010 - 07:54 am: |
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Good luck, Saul. We just went cable-free (OTA only) and it still pains me to think we were paying the cable company money for *basically* the same thing we could get OTA, at least all the channels we were watching in their basic set. |
Jay
Advanced Member
Username: Jay214128
Post Number: 273
Registered: 06-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, March 26, 2010 - 10:24 am: |
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holl_ands posted "You might want to avoid the Sansonic FT300A. It won't support
adding stations when you change antenna directions and only displays info for program currently being watched (no guide)."
I looked at the Apex DT502 manual and it too does not support manually adding channels. It only allows you to set previously scanned channels as viewable and/or favorite.
I'm looking for an ATSC settop converter box that will allow me to manually add/scan individual channels. The CM-7000 does support an Add Scan feature which may accomplish this, but I can no longer find it available for sale.
I have a DTV Pal DVR, which does have the ability to manually scan channels, but has the very bad "feature" of continuously scanning for new/changed channels. This causes it to always renumber and delete my channels, so I'm looking for a replacement. Does anyone know of a settop converter that does permit manual channel adding/scanning? |
JoeM
Advanced Member
Username: Joem
Post Number: 151
Registered: 09-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, March 26, 2010 - 11:04 am: |
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Solidsignal.com used to have LG clones for about $25. But they sold out of them and many others, but I think they still have the CM (expensive). Anyone know if Fry's still carries it ?
(Message edited by Joem on March 26, 2010) |
holl_ands
Advanced Member
Username: Holl_ands
Post Number: 2314
Registered: 06-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, March 26, 2010 - 12:04 pm: |
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My CECB Features spread sheet said "Tune To Add" for the DT502,
based on info I read somewhere.....
But now that I've tried to use that feature, I'm convinced it DOES NOT WORK.
Although the scan is very quick, I had to rescan every time
I changed the antenna (I was adjusting Gain on a RabbitEars/Loop).
I didn't find anything wrt whether DT502A was any different....
BTW: R/C buttons on DT502 are total junk....I use my Harmony...
So DT502 displays more than current program...and FT300A has better R/C. |
Saul
Member
Username: Fishnugget
Post Number: 15
Registered: 03-2010
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, March 26, 2010 - 01:49 pm: |
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Okay, so the consensus is that a converter box with the ability to add channels manually is hard to find?
I'm still bummed about not being able to capture CBS and ABC. However, I am going to talk to my landlord today and will probably mount the antenna on one of those telescoping painters poles from Home Depot and pray that I get them.
I saw the channels my cable provider offers and its really the same channels the antenna is picking up. Why should I pay 18 bucks a month when they are free OTA. |
Gary Stigall, XETV
Moderator
Username: Garys
Post Number: 563
Registered: 12-2002
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, March 26, 2010 - 02:20 pm: |
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I really like the LG/Zenith/Insignia boxes. They have excellent tuners and you can manually enter or add a new channel. I do wish they had S-Video out for better video quality.
Gary Stigall
Dir. of Engineering
Bay City TV - XETV
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holl_ands
Advanced Member
Username: Holl_ands
Post Number: 2315
Registered: 06-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, March 26, 2010 - 03:01 pm: |
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Here's my CECB Features Spread Sheet, last updated 15Oct2008:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14872530
I listed Add-A-Channel and whether "Antenna Signal Level"
is displayed in addition to "Quality % Bar".
Airlink101 ATVC101 has both meters & Add-a-Channel.
Avoid GE CECBs, they have poor picture quality.
You might also want to check wiki:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_CECB_units
FWIW: Wiki for DT502 sez "No Channel Update" (Feature "N") but
does NOT have a similar entry for the DT502A....I dunno...
As with all things wiki, double check EVERYTHING....
I don't even TRY to bounce my (99.94% verified) list against wiki....
NAB tested about 19 CECB's including whether they could add a channel:
http://www.nabfastroad.org/NAB-STV%20Digital%20Converter%20Box%20Evaluation/Manuals-summary-report1.html
[See Table 3-B.]
Note what NAB calls a "Signal Level" meter is measuring "% Goodness"
in the data and NOT the Signal Strength at the Antenna.
(Message edited by holl_ands on March 26, 2010) |
JoeM
Advanced Member
Username: Joem
Post Number: 152
Registered: 09-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 29, 2010 - 04:49 pm: |
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Holl ands wrote:
"Avoid GE CECBs, they have poor picture quality. "
Unfortunately, that info is not up to date. For example in a November 2008 Consumer Report, the GE models 23334 and 23333 were rated as good as the Zenith in picture quality.
I would be cautious if you try Target's STB7766C (as in "Cow"). It's uses the same chipset as the RCA DTA800B1. I have the DTA800B1 and for some reason it does NOT display the two Mexican Azteca stations, even though it's on the CECB's station list and the signal strength is indicated as strong. The STB7766C might be improved and work, but then again it might not.
I'd try the CECB section of the Avsforum for more up-to-date info. |
General over-the-air (OTA) 